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In the race between Natalie Johnson-Lee, the beloved 5th Ward incumbent (Green Party) and Don Samuels, the DFL-endorsed challenger, there has been much debate surrounding comments made by Samuels regarding the race and comments that were made where he referred to his house as the big house and made references to slavery that obviously is a sensitive area for some African Americans. After the statements were made there was an uproar in the community to get an explanation of the nature of the comments from the "horse's mouth." Also people were concerned that the redistricting and the Samuel Endorsement by the DFL were steps to remove Natalie from her much desirable 5th ward seat. Others in the community view this as a positive step for the community. It is their belief that this will be a positive stride for the community in regards to establishing a clear stance on the ability to define the leadership role that is much needed in the North Side community.

Several weeks ago I caught up Don Samuels at the Bean Scene in North Minneapolis where he had the following to say to the Liberator. We felt obligated to give Mr. Samuels a chance to openly discuss his thoughts on receiving the DFL endorsement, how this race will effect the community and also to bring more clarity to the comments that some feel to think have been blown out of proportion and others belief was his downfall as a potential candidate. In the interview that follows Samuels addresses his views of the new 5th ward and combats the claims of being an Uncle Tom.

Bob: There is a fear among long time 5^th ward residence who feel that with you and Natalie running against each other is causing division between the camps that were previously able to stand behind the two of you. What steps will you take to repair this?

DS: I think this is part of the maturing of the community when the community is besieged and it sees itself as only being able to only have one leader that is a relatively primitive stage of a community's development. When we can look into our ranks and select a leader, that is a community showing maturity. I think that this is a good struggle for us to go through now I think the best thing for me and Natalie to do is to get together with the community and talk about what we are going to do with this community and talk about what we have done and if we do that and just stick to the issues and stay away from the other feelings, then I think that it will be a uniting factor and the people will say hey there are two people who are going against each other, they have a good attitude towards each other and they are doing this all for us and that will change the complexion of everything.

Bob: The next question is regarding the DFL, a lot of people feel that after Wellstone passed away that the DFL has abandoned the black community and lost a lot of the influence it once held, now with you getting the DFL endorsement do you feel that the DFL is an asset to your campaign or do you feel your campaign is an asset for reconnecting the DFL with the community?

DS: It took me a long time in my life to say that I was a leader I really run away from that title but I am going to try and embrace it and also say I am a leader for the DFL and I can help the DFL interact with this community and how to provide support for this community. So I also think that the DFL is also immature, clearly we got our but kicked in the presidential election and everybody is saying that the DFL is psychologically floundering. Over the years and I think the African American community, more so then any other community, can teach the DFL how to be the DFL and I would like to be a part of that process.

Bob: What do you see as an important step for the loosing candidate to align his/herself up with the community after the election is over?

DS: I would tell you what mine would be if I lost, which is not going to happen. If I were to loose I would do exactly what I was doing before I was desperately trying to grab a hold of some kind of handle that would help to make some kind of significant change in the status of the community working with my neighbors on my block in fact before I decided to become a council member to run my wife and I had just begun the process of starting a church inside of our house and we were going to call it a block church cause we realized that one of the problems is that we have these commuter churches where middle class people are commuting in to these churches and parachuting in, and so we said forget it lets try and see if we can get our sustenance from some other place and lets start a church on our block for like the hundred kids on our block and lets get them in to some kind of little Sunday school thing and if their parents find out their kids' lives are changing they will come and we are just gonna have a block church. We have like a 3-block-long block, so that is a vision I had to walk away from. That was a very difficult decision and so I am very torn about that so I would basically fall right back into that.

Bob: I would like to give you the opportunity to address the statements you made and allow us to hear what you meant from your mouth as oppose to everyone's interpretation of what you meant.

DS: "Well look I am a designer I spent my life violating the rules. If you designed one thing that was designed before, you are a failure. I cannot call myself a creative person and not come to the table with something that has never been seen before and that is how I approach my life. I did that for 27 years so that is how I am doing politics I am going to bring something to the table that was never heard before otherwise you don't need me and so I am going to say some things that are going to sound weird to people because we are in a stalemate folks. It's been 400 years and there's still an under class of black people here and people are calling themselves successful and believing in spite of all of this so I am saying hey you know something, I am failing as a leader. I have not created enough change around here yet so I am desperately looking for ways to change the way I talk, to change the way we talk, to change the way we look at the problems, to change the way we approach things, and so I am going to say some things that are controversial it is not going to stop. So if you are interested in controversy follow me around cause I intend to try and make change happen. So basically the whole race thing is in a stalemate we have had diversity training for 20 years so my wife and I started a business called Institute For Authentic Dialogue with a white guy from the South who had Klan members in his family and who was on the other side of the civil rights movement. Now we are gonna force that union in a business to have authentic dialogue across race. That means I have to tell him what I really feel about him and myself. And I have been guilty as a white man for looking down on black people. Me, Don Samuels, I can tell you that, I grew up being taught that kinky hair was bad, that thick lips were ugly, we teased my brother who had the thickest lips and the widest nose. The kids in my school teased the darker skinned kids. The darkest girls were the ugliest ones and the light skinned girls were the cutest ones. I am saying those things. Can I say that? Can I admit that my great-great grandfather was a house slave and that he was light skinned and got perks for it and that it happened all across the colonial black world? Can I say that? I am admitting that. I am not saying that for anybody else but myself. I do hear that there used to be a little paper bag test. I don't know if any body wants to admit that that they did it but I am sure that there are some people still alive that did that, but we have to give room for people to admit things like that. That is all I am doing. I am giving white people room to admit they are racist; it's just a seductive thing folks. Because if we point our finger at them and say they are racist they are going to run away and say "I am not" because then I am saying I am righteous and I am superior. I am saying we are all human, I have my little version of the race thing going and you have your little version I am just reframing the conversation in a way that everybody feels safe to come out of the closet with their racist nastiness that we can say "yeah when the light skinned girl walks by I look and when the dark skinned one walks by I don't." Because guess what? All the dark skinned girls know it -- the ones living now. I am not talking about my great-great grandfather I am talking about my girlfriends who are dark and go to clubs and all the black brothers are dancing with the white girls and nobody asks them. So can I admit mine so that the brother doing that can admit what he is doing and we can all come out of the closet and say let's come clean and let's try and make this thing right? That's all I am trying to do but if we keep pointing fingers then everybody is going to run for cover and say "I am not guilty." I am guilty. I, Don Samuels, am guilty and every black and white person in America is guilty let's put all the cards on the table and stop pointing fingers at people."

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